They sent he sent his scent those two samples with his to Wyoming an unfortunate Fish and Game Commission there did not get a positive read on it but send it back to Central Michigan University where they did a nuclear micro satellite DNA analysis and found no significant difference between that scat and other scats that were tested from the Rocky Mountain region. And now that everyone and their mother has a remote camera in their back yard its just so, so unlikely that there are resident, breeding mountain lions in New England that are living invisibly among us, he says, Its become Big Foot.. The females disperse a shorter range and once they find a vacant home range they stay in that location and live there. Patrick Tate: I've from all the situations I've read and learned about wildlife. And so I just wanted to share my share my experience with you guys and it was pretty awesome to see if you get to see one albeit it was in the brush. Email exchange it an HP fraud org or give us a call 1 800 8 9 2 6 4 7 7. Thanks for a great thanks. Thank you. She is renowned for tracking. So you know until I found those two scats I didn't think that mountain lions were here in the east. Caller: I cannot recall or see the tail in my in my image of it. But if you were to get Western dispersing mountain lions just would just sort of expanding into New Hampshire. The second one was not only fresh but when I actually put my hand on it it was you know smelled like cat and I it's there's no denying a fresh mountain lions get if you can tell it every story that KOAT. It was determined that Mountain Lion came from the Dakotas across the Northern part of our country . Infinite Scroll Enabled. So we tossed these terms around but really the term subspecies has been sort of redefined in our lifetimes. Peter Biello: So let's say Rick that it was confirmed that there that there are mountain lines here in New Hampshire. Author of The last woman in the forest on Saturday July 13th at 7 p.m. at Warner town hall Warner historical dawg. The sightings have not been confirmed; in fact, there have been no confirmed mountain lion sightings in New Hampshire since one was shot and killed on the seacoast in the 1850s, said Patrick Tate . m from a weed family Automotive on store Street in Concord is serving the Concord area families automotive needs since 1995. The species that once inhabited the Northeast, known as the eastern mountain lion, is now extinct. So when we talk about the threshold of evidence required to say for sure you have seen a mountain lion it is rather high. Caller: I got home to my wife that a gene that you should have seen the cat. What Really Caused Washington's Cougar Attack. I was a Bobcat we saw it and I have a picture of it. Well let's hear from from Sue Morse again science director for the organization keeping track. So for me as a person who's had the Bobcats right off my grits similar carries sticks to a bobcat The Long Tail obviously very different but those facial markings were overlapping for me. Mountain lion DNA was recovered from a Petersham, Mass., close to the New Hampshire border, after a 2016 incident in which a horse was injured. It was a 140-pound male mountain lion, the first confirmed in Connecticut in more than 100 years. 1 800 8 9 2 6 4 7 7. We live around Cold Springs Campground and it was undeniably a mountain lion. So. I wanted to get your thoughts on the mystique of the mountain lion start with you Rick. Peter Biello: Yeah well what do you think Pat is. Some of the reports that I looked into that were actually on file at the local fish and game office were even from people who did not live locally. Are there other powers that be worried that scary mountain lions will scare off people from camping in New Hampshire. But my experience was that the majority of these accounts could not be taken lightly. So let's let's go to the phones. Border Well within there. Mountain lions remain an enigmatic animal for residents of New Hampshire, with New Hampshire Fish and Game reporting three to five sightings per week. Peter Biello: Listeners give us a call if you have a question or a story of a sighting 1 800 8 9 2 6 4 7 7. And boy it was big it had to be at least 200 pounds the thing was you and and it just made a little bit of noise and it was gone. Credit: Elizabeth Nichols via Storyful . So hard to know hard to refute if there's no interest in making up a story which many people of course do then I would respond the same way as Pat did. And I have to use that word allegedly because there is so much dispute about what people see and what they actually see. To date most of the pictures that have been sent in have been bobcats and other species Ive received pictures of house cats. Rick van de Poll: Well the mountain lion of course has been sort of an enigma in the wildlife suite for years and years. Just. Sam Evans-Brown: One in fact Helena silver in that sort of tome that Rick van de Poll read from at the beginning is she. Fish and Wildlife Service decided all of the cougars, pumas, and mountain lions in the country are actually the same species, and that species hasnt had a breeding population anywhere near the Northeast for at least 70 years. Mountain lions live in the state. Patrick Tate: I've had hunters hang deer carcasses forbidding wildlife entries. No I saw a camel. Yeah 13 to 15 years ago 13 to 15 years ago. I came to a stop and it was and I've seen a lot of bobcats in my time and I just came to a stop it was just sort of confused about what I was seeing. And I saw you cat about four feet long from nose to tail come across from the water across the road and just leap over a six foot perimeter fence in a single bound. I believe I saw one that's fine and I'm not looking for an immediate story. The last Massachusetts Mountain Lion was killedaround 1858. This is a machine-generated transcript, and may contain errors. And I I have this great text history of New Hampshire game and fir bears and I think by Helen Silver who used to work for fish and game and she sort of I kind eyes this animal in one of the quotes from 1892 stating that the catamaran was the most ferocious of all the wild beasts of New Hampshire his great size strength and agility of movement together with his formidable weapons rendered him the terror both of man and beast. The cougar is also commonly known as mountain lion, puma, mountain cat, catamount, or panther. Peter Biello: Mm hmm. Patrick Tate: My line being a large predator a cat watch ambush his prey animal that hasn't been. I have one that's more elaborate than that. Caller: Are probably. You know interactions are pretty unusual. Caller: Yeah. Something along those lines. You don't know what's going on. Michael Brindley is our program manager our producers our Jessica Hunt and Christina Phillips and our theme music was composed by Bob Lord. So I certainly can't dispute anything that they said there's no evidence for me to go by to verify or say what my thoughts are on the situation. No that's a little bit outside the range. Mountain Lion report and as a biologist for the state that's a situation where if he said to me what did I see. Listeners give us a call if you'd like. Peter Biello: Oh okay. Known to exist in the state for over well over a hundred years. Caller: Yeah I hadn't experienced blastoff fall so this was around September and I was driving from Webster into Concord on Horse Hill Road and anybody in the area would know I was right near the Red Barn and all of a sudden this animal jumps out of the woods and it bounded across the road in about two two giant leaps and stopped in the field just on the other side. Patrick Tate: So I'm not sure what subspecies of cat they're using to differentiate by those markings but once she was describing the White other face in the black. SUE Morse naturalist and science director for the organization keeping track. Peter Biello: Ok weird question but do they make good pets. So maybe a good pet for you but not for your neighbor if you just stop by unannounced. So what those ranges. So I want to start the program with a comment from someone who is not in the studio with us today. Peter Biello: This is the exchange on an HP yard today we're talking about the mysterious elusive majestic Mystic Mountain Lion. We'll hear from her periodically through the show. After apparently trying unsuccessfully to get the young lion to leave, the man decided to shoot it. This animal, IMHO, was probably live caught as an adult from the wild and brought to the . So try to take photographs if you see something like this. Peter Biello: So if they were female mountain lions here they would be more males just because that's what they're looking for. What's going on. Join as a sustainer and support independent local news for your community. Peter Biello: Hmm. It was killed in Lee New Hampshire in 1853. What's interesting about Bobcats is here in the Northeast we have some very large bobcats. However, dispersing western mountain lions have left evidence as close as Connecticut, Massachusetts and New York. Pelosi story here we go. That's pretty elaborate. Peter Biello: Thank you for sharing that. So what a neat experience. Does not test random Scouts. Thanks for taking my call. Give us a call if you have a question or comments or story about perhaps seeing a mountain lion here in New Hampshire. He shifted gears in 2016 and began producing Outside/In, a podcast and radio show about the natural world and how we use it. His work has won him several awards, including two regional Edward R. Murrow awards, one national Murrow, and the Overseas Press Club of America's award for best environmental reporting in any medium. Patrick Tate: Okay. Peter Biello: Well John thanks very much for the story really appreciate it. Let's talk to Bob in Laconia Bob. Having not found any evidence is not the same as saying there are no mountain lions, its the same as saying we dont know. More than 450 Facebook users as of Thursday had shared a photo Marc Weir posted Wednesday showing the big cat and . The great thing about pictures isn't the animal itself it's the background. Your support makes this news available to everyone. So Marty can you see what I'm getting at is the public sees different names and thinks that they're different animals but it's all the same animal. Right. They reported seeing the big tail and everything everything. Fear for others and those two polarizing opinions on the situation is what I believe brings out mystique and Sam you know I take kind of a long view on this. Ecosystem Management Consultants of New England, Ask Sam, and recently fielded question about mountain lions, In latest school funding trial, state attorneys argue NH districts' budgets are bloated, Lawmakers, advocates, families in NH react to Biden Admin's proposed Title IX change, Give Back NH: The New England Grassroots Environment Fund, NHs housing crisis is pushing more older adults to seek help, We also hear excerpts from an interview with, Read about the most recent cougar "sightings". Give today. Rick van de Poll: Yes. She was having a garden party on her back porch and everybody in the party saw this mountain lion across the field down below the porch. They don't know the direction they're going. Yes. So what counts as verifiable evidence? Thank you. Let's look for other evidence. When you talk about a bobcat Bobcat maybe 80 90 pounds and then a mountain lion could be between 130 and 180 pounds. It was killed in Lee New Hampshire in 1853. Caller: Oh yeah. The last known mountain lion killed in New Hampshire is displayed at the Woodman Museum in Dover. There was no sign of it. Patrick Tate: Well I've never seen an Easter cougar so I can't say when I've handled these 10 cougars and whatnot. And that's this morning at 10:00 here on NH PR. John if you're still on the line here I was going to I don't. The last catamount in Vermont is finally, officially, certainly dead. Now Bobcat is a completely different species. For all the men out there that don't realize it. I saw a mountain lion on my property in NE corner of Dutchess County about 6 years ago -- the cat (or a cat) had been spotted many times over the years and was believed to have been introduced and escaped from a nearby Hunting Preserve. New Hampshire Fish and Game Department says there's no proof. By, March 2023 Fund Drive Rules and Regulations, Persons with disabilities who need assistance accessing NHPR's FCC public files, please contact us at publicfile@nhpr.org. OK. That location they just described we had two or three Bobcats radio collared on just off the runway in Laconia airport. Now that to me seemed to indicate that they had done the secondary workup that in my opinion proved the existence of probably a disperse or possibly from South Dakota like the one in 2011. On June 9 2021 I saw a Mountain Lion along the Connecticut river in Clarksville New Hampshire . Sue Morse: The big cat really commands the utmost respect not so much fear but fascination. Don't miss your chance to win three two thousand dollar gas gift cards at any station of your choice not to mention the grand prize twenty five thousand dollars toward a new car. Peter Biello: Ok. Sam Evans-Brown has been working for New Hampshire Public Radio since 2010, when he began as a freelancer. The experts' take on what happened last Saturday when a mountain lion killed one cyclist and injured another outside of Seattle. We send out DNA samples to the U.S. Forest Service Rocky Mountain Research Station. What kind of animal is that. So so. Rick van de Poll: Well a report that you know as John Harrigan up north has in co-ops County for about 15 years I kept track of reports and people would call me and tell me where they saw the mountain lion they thought they saw it and it varied right from you know downtown villages all the way to remote highlands of the North Country and and everywhere in between. And it's not really strong. They just end up in these places. Peter Biello: We got an e-mail question from Robert in Epsom who asks are sightings or encounters with these big cats less dangerous here where they're passing through than out west where those same mountain lines might be establishing territory Rick. Theyve always said when we have verifiable evidence to say a mountain lion has been, is, or was in the state that wed acknowledge that and give that information out, says Pat Tate, the furbearer biologist with New Hampshire Fish and Game, who insists theres no conspiracy. Every other Friday on Morning Edition NHPRs Sam Evans-Brown tracks down answers to questions about the environment and outdoors for our listeners in a segment we call Ask Sam.. Caller: Hey guys how you doing. Peter Biello: The number is 1 800 8 9 2 6 4 7 7. Well just that I have evidence and it was not it was denied by fishing game at the time and I you know there's I don't need to prove to anybody that I saw one just like some of your callers said okay. He says when youve got a mountain lion in town, its kinda obvious. Well let's talk a little bit about that. Can you look into this picture. Wed love to be part of the first verified sighting. The last wild mountain lion in New Hampshire may have been killed in the White Mountains in 1885. Sam Evans-Brown: Certainly that is a thing I've heard but again you have to think of the incentives involved here. And as the biologist who's gonna stand on this and if I'm going to say this is a proven picture I need to be able to stand on it so soundly and have the evidence so I going to go through it with a fine tooth comb kept picking pieces apart trying to answer these pieces. SYCAMORE, Ill. (AP) A mountain lion that was struck and killed last weekend along a northern Illinois highway will be analyzed by biologists seeking to uncover the rare animal's origins, state . And you know it's rather interesting because certainly there are those you as a case of mistaken identity or they wanted to see something that perhaps they actually didn't. Patrick Tate: Yes. Sam Evans-Brown: But I mean the video I had been sent was you know a recording of a animal growling but it was in slow motion and when I asked the person why is this in slow motion the denied that it was so there's a lot of weird stuff that happens in regards to people claiming they've seen they've seen these things. Still, it's been over 100 years since the last mountain lion was killed east of the Mississippi, except for a patch of them down in Florida, where there are supposed to be 100 to 200 still living. However if if and when it does happen it takes up a lot of resources looking at that situation and identifying what's going on because when you start out you don't know it's a hoax. The unheralded hero of Apollo John Hubble the man who knew the way to the moon. Sam Evans-Brown: Pretty well I was going to say it is nice to hear about how to identify the facial markings but probably I'd being a to identify the tracks is probably the more useful useful tool that one can have in their tool box. The American Lion The Saber tooth Tiger and this was the one that survived. PublishedNovember 16, 2018 at 6:16 AM EST. You need a permit to have that. So I did a bunch of research and all the documentation I found was there art are not any pieces of DNA of Eastern online. Really appreciate it. And there are thousands of mountain lions killed every year legally through hunting, and there have been untold tens of thousands of mountain lions killed by hunters over the last hundred years, says Mark Elbroch, the Puma Program Director for Panthera, a global wild cat conservation organization, So even the folks who live with mountain lions still have a fancy and see something thats not there to me thats incredible.. And I think this is a really interesting story for a couple of reasons one is that it proves what Pat was saying which that basically from New York state where its traces was really picked up on a game camera around Lake George all the way down to Connecticut there was numerous. New York on Easter Sunday. Today she talked with us a little bit before the show about why the mountain line is so compelling and why we want it to be part of our world. What do you think that. State officials confirmed the presence of a mountain lion near the Quabbin Reservoir in the late 1990s. Caller: So I've been telling this story for five years or so and very few people believe me. I just don't understand the mechanism for how that would happen. Sam Evans-Brown: And when we talk about subspecies this actually leads to to an interesting tangent which is that the field of biology recently has been sort of revolutionized by the use of DNA to determine what subspecies are. Mountain Lions are a mythical creature in New Hampshire with strong feelings on both sides of the question: are there Mountain Lions in New Hampshire? I really really enjoyed listening to this program so thank you all very much. Through DNA they approximate area in the United States or North America where I was born. You know you have to have a license and it's hard to get that license a license to own a mountain lion. But before I go any further I want to say we do not have sufficient game. So I reached down to grab the camera and looked back and like a ghost it's gone. And I was probably about a half a mile from downtown all village on the right. Do we have native species that could have exhibited this type of behavior leaving leaving a deer carcass up in a tree. But but I've also seen it cited the opposite way that look they're very secretive. Patrick Tate: Exactly I was gonna bring that up juvenile male of. And that the Florida panther was more closely related to the eastern outline than the western mountain lion was. Let's go now to to Kyle in Keene I believe Kyle is this Kyle Jarvis from the Keene Sentinel a former reporter and former reporter. And there are thousands of mountain lions killed every year legally through hunting, and there have been untold tens of thousands of mountain lions killed by hunters over the last hundred. Anyways after three weeks I finally found the image on line on a field and stream photo contest and the explanation in the end was the person that set the camera out with another individual and they believed that someone who knew of the camera location saw the similarities put the can't picture on their SD card so it looked like that camera recorded the image that is. I'm Peter Biello. I've collected scat samples I've got several in my collection. And I can recall its information but I can't confirm or verify anything. State officials have said, over and over in recent years, that the eastern mountain lion has been completely wiped out from the Northeast. Mountain lion or cat running across. Reviewing the evidence, the U.S. You treat it as if it's a sincere situation. There have been several alleged sightings of mountain lions in New Hampshire recently. So when we hear mountain lion there's also cougar there's wild cat there's Bobcat which is not a mountain lion maybe Patrick could you sort of spell out the different terms which are synonymous and which are completely different animals. And so maybe before I go to you recommend I ask you Patrick Tate is the standard too high. If youve got photo trap evidence of a Mountain Lion, send it in, and we'll send it along to the appropriate state or federal agency! The states never denied mountain lions are here, and theyve never admitted mountain lions are here. Rick van de Poll: Well I didn't. Peter Biello: Give us a call 1 800 8 9 2 6 4 7 7 you can also send us an email exchange at an HP morgue. They're just moving around freely. We had six copies printed out each. Theres a project called the Cougar Network that tracks verified sightings, and they are all around us: Massachusetts, Connecticut, Maine, New York and New Brunswick have all had verified sightings over the past 20 years or so. The New Hampshire lion has become something of the state's own Big Foot, commonly discussed and rumored but never confirmed; at least, not since the 1850s, when the last mountain lion in the . But along the lines of the conspiracy theories as you mentioned earlier there there was a bit of a sense on behalf of what I'll call the promo online community who felt that fishing gain maybe not even so much in a spoken policy but maybe sort of an unspoken policy did not want to find themselves in a situation where they had to spend money to create a management plan and so forth. Okay. Share. There wasn't a distinct subspecies the North American mountain lion is all is all one species and then you can find a genetically distinct South American subspecies. That's too big for Bobcat. And Rick Van de Poll naturalist and founder of ecosystem management consultants of New England. And it came out we could see it had and we could see its long swooping tail. And to anyone listening I would just say you know fishing game who wants proof right. A middle school in Manchester, New Hampshire has sent out an alert after a mountain lion was spotted. So give us a call now. A 140-pound male mountain lion was hit by a car and killed in 2011 in Milford, Connecticut. But I do think that it's appropriate that a fishing game agency would recognize verifiable proof if they could. And really whenever you hear tiny code and long rope like tale it's kind of hard to pin this sighting on any other creature rather than an outline or just nothing else really matches that description. So there is definitely no downward pressure by anyone. So I learned about what Rick just reported through a heart of heart of New Hampshire a letter and. Caller: It had to be a mountain lion convinced I was about 30. I just stood there just a second and I came to a complete stop and then I ran away. I'm Peter Biello in for Laura NOI. I live pretty much on the town line of Greenfield just a couple of miles down in the Greenfield. So the whole media hype about how scary mountain lions are should should go away immediately and that would be that I think the major thrust of educating folks about these casualties vs.. Sam Evans-Brown: Sam go ahead. The last known mountain lion killed in New Hampshire is displayed at the Woodman Museum in Dover. The number 1 800 8 9 2 6 4 7 7 so promised a discussion about conspiracy theories. Peter Biello: Wow. So for our scientists to do the lumping and whatnot. And then just up behind it you know at about 11 o'clock on one side and whatever that would be on the other side it's black. And still the the folks there did weren't able to come up with it with 100 percent certainty what deposited that scat. How far were you from this cat. So I think the point that I just want to get across is that there is a very strong sense this here in the and not region that there is that there is some sort of mountain lion population how large it is how extensive it is. So so in 2011 a mountain lion was killed in a car accident in Connecticut a car hit a mountain lion and killed it. If you have them email exchange at an HP board or give us a call to tell us your story. Sam Evans-Brown: Well and I think and the last takeaway here is everyone I think probably agrees that any possible sightings that have been seen. 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